[dolfrog]

Hi All

This not the first time that the existance of dyslexia has been questoned, and put back any improvemnet in understanding that we all need to help us through life.

We need to find a defintion of Dyslexia, which we can advocate and we can defend based on our experiences, and the experiences of other dyslexics.

Academics do not deny that dyslexia exists but they troll through all the research and are not able to find a single theory that satisfies their research criteria. They are looking for a single condition dyslexia. May be dyslexia is not a condition in ists own right, but a cllecrove term for a who range of different conditions which can display the imilar symptoms of having problems with reading, writing and spelling the written word.

We need to seperate dyslexia from literacy, as thye are two distinctly different issues, most dyslexics are literate, but they still have problems with written language, due to some form of neurologicla difference or deficit, which they may well be good at running coping strategies to work around the problems. But these coping strategies do not work so well in times of stress or illness. So we never stop having theses dyslexic problems however good we are at coping with them on a good day.

Most will know my own views of this as thye are well documented all over this forum so I will not repeat them

best wishes


dolfrog

[Womble]

Dyslexia is dat fing wot amkes me spazzy in the head......

[blinki]

I think just saying written language problems is a bit off, there's difficulties like being able to construct an argument in your head

Those sort of things need clarified first. If Dyslexia is a group of conditions then you may as well define the group before you go trying to define sub-groups

[lomo]

what she said. oh except... dyslexia is what makes me look rather silly and unsuitable in front of important people because i find it hard to recall facts on demand!

nice to see you back df :whistling:

Womble, on Jan 20 2009, 12:19 AM, said:

Dyslexia is dat fing wot amkes me spazzy in the head......

[Gattaca]

I’ve heard people with Aspergers describe themselves as having an ‘executive skills dysfunction’. Executive skills cover areas such as short term memory, directed attention, multi-tasking, sequencing (but not specifically literacy).

Perhaps dyslexia could be define in a similar way…
As a ’literacy related executive skills dysfunction’.

Which is of course...just another way of saying...
“dat fing wot amkes me spazzy in the head...…”

[dolfrog]

Hi Gattaca

Historically Dyslexia was
{Identified for the first time by Oswald Berkhan in 1881, [3] the term 'dyslexia' was coined in 1887 by Rudolf Berlin, an ophthalmologist practicing in Stuttgart, Germany.[4] He used the term to refer to a case of a young boy who had a severe impairment in learning to read and write in spite of showing typical intellectual and physical abilities in all other respects.} taken from wiki dyslexia web page http://en.wikipedia....xia_definitions

In the UK we seem to have added many other issues to create a much larger umbrella term which becomes more vague and less useful the more that is added to it. We seem to be geeting away from others appear to understand as dyslexia.

Remembering information for speech is a problems of auditory memory or an auditory processing issue trying to process the meaning of the question being asked, which not related to the written langauge which is what dyslexia is about according to most research and international definitions where they recognise the existance of dyslexia.

Surely dyslexia is about having problem processing the information contained in the form of written language.
All other issues have different and seperate causes.
This would define dyslexia as the problem it really is, and then we need to define the neurological issues that causes us to have these and other related problems.

best wishes


dolfrog

Hi Lomo
I needed the break, too many things happening for me to keep track of lol

G

Gattaca, on Jan 21 2009, 12:03 AM, said:

I’ve heard people with Aspergers describe themselves as having an ‘executive skills dysfunction’. Executive skills cover areas such as short term memory, directed attention, multi-tasking, sequencing (but not specifically literacy).

Perhaps dyslexia could be define in a similar way…
As a ’literacy related executive skills dysfunction’.

Which is of course...just another way of saying...
“dat fing wot amkes me spazzy in the head...…”

[Gattaca]

My post above was a personal and subjective observation…based on what I consider to be some of the potential root causes of dyslexia.

In the (strictest sense) dyslexia can be ‘defined as problems with written language resulting from neurological differences in the brain.’

However I think it’s reasonably clear that the cognitive processes that result in dyslexia (the memory, sequencing, auditory processing difficulties etc) can effect more than just written language; so it’s reasonable for people to want that recognised too.

But perhaps (for the sake of clarity) we should keep dyslexia to the literal definition…‘problems with written language’. But recognise that it’s caused by other factors--which can also be defined; such as short tern memory impairment, auditory processing disorder scoptic sensitivity etc.

It’s quite easy for us (here on this website) to speak about dyslexia--most of us either have it or are trained professionals who understand the nuances of the condition. But it’s hard to precisely define it to others.
Unfortunately (as with many things) the more you look into them the more nebulous and interconnected with other things they become; and the harder it is to come up with a concise ‘cover-all’ term to define them.

[Cariad]

Interesting point Gattaca,
Maybe that's the reason there are too many misunderstandings about dyslexia. The focus is always on how dyslexia have literacy difficulties. Their other difficulties are rarely mentioned.

It is often mistakenly assumed that just because someone has literacy problems that they are dyslexic. Dyslexics produce common characteristics which non dyslexics who have literacy difficulties don't. Too many NON dyslexics jump on the dyslexia wagon to justify their literacy problems rather than admit to other issues. Or, just like that MP, people don't have a proper understanding of the full issues of dyslexia and make incorrect statements about it which clouds the issue.

[doubledee]

I was going to say ........'dyslexia' is the difference between a Bush speech and an Obama speech :whistling:

But perhaps that wouldn't fit if we're going to define it tightly to "difficulties with written language" !!!

I think this is the problem........at the moment some people want dyslexia to be a very narrow set of symptoms to do with reading failure - for laudable reasons. They have seen that techniques that help diagnosed dyslexics help other poor readers & they want to get that very effective help to a wider audience. (It is a big problem in our school system if a dyslexia diagnosis is the only thing that secures the right help for a child. If a child needs help they should get it dyslexic or not surely.)

But a lot of people see their own dyslexia as causing a wider range of symptoms & they mean " that thing that makes me spazzy in the head" in a much wider way........

Perhaps - "a set of underlying neurological dysfunctions of currently unknown origins that impact language skills, especially written language skills, but which may also produce skill deficits in other areas - oral language, motor, and executive functions" ... and any others I've missed out......

But that's a biological definition good for researchers -in school you would probably want a more symptom based definition ......although thinking about it maybe what you need in schools is a "if they are x behind with reading, and making y sort of mistakes, try this intervention z" sort of thing - more like a car manual !!

[lankyT]

Hi for me maybe its more a definition of what it isnt


a myth

a joke

a lie

an illness

and what it doesnt mean

Im not lazy

Im not thick

Im not retarded

[Gattaca]

I think perhaps it’s important to consider not just how we define dyslexia--but who defines it. Should what dyslexia is be defined by psychologists and health professionals; should it be defined by teachers, employers--or should it be defined by dyslexics themselves? Who should get to say what dyslexia is?

It’s also worth noting that there are still a fair few unanswered questions concerning dyslexia. So any definition over and above ‘difficulties with written language’ is likely to be incomplete and also may change over time.

[dolfrog]

Hi Gattaca

defining Dyslexia requires two type of input,
1) those who have to problems so that thye can describe the variuous problems they face
so dyslexics have to explain the range of problems that thye have using the wriiten word (or the visual notation of speech)
which varies from cutlture to culture
2) there needs to be professionals who understand the workings of the brain, inline with current International research, this would be best be done by a group of Neurologists, who specialaise in wide range og neurologicla issues.
the other groups you have mentiones all try to be supportive but they do not have access or understnd many of the medical or neurologigla issues that contribute to having the dyslexic symptoms.
This has been the problems so far there have been too many self interest groups who put their own best interests first and real Dyslexics second.


best wishes


dolfrog

Gattaca, on Jan 22 2009, 03:04 PM, said:

I think perhaps it’s important to consider not just how we define dyslexia--but who defines it. Should what dyslexia is be defined by psychologists and health professionals; should it be defined by teachers, employers--or should it be defined by dyslexics themselves? Who should get to say what dyslexia is?

It’s also worth noting that there are still a fair few unanswered questions concerning dyslexia. So any definition over and above ‘difficulties with written language’ is likely to be incomplete and also may change over time.

[geodob]

Not Stupid, Just Dyslexic.

This is perhaps the most important definition of Dyslexia.

[Ishi]

I've always understood dyslexia as a processing difficulty. I do not believe it is a learning difficulty, because in my own experience I have absolutely no problem is learning. Sure I have problems reading at times, visual stress, and my listening is a bit squiffy, but this only hinders the smooth flow of information (in and out).

Having a learning difficulty/disability/difference is always going to make other people think you're a "spazz" (thanks Womble, that really made me laugh!).