[wilsongard]

do u think u have dyslexia... wat are the signs n symptoms of dyslexia
visit the following site;
http://dyslexiatreat...lexia-symptoms/

[Rod Duncan]

Hi Wilsongard,

Your site speaks about 'curing dyslexia'. Do you regard it as a disease?

All the best.

[CatChester]

My word, I've been here under a week but this board just seems to be bombarded by creeps with cures! Is it really that common or did I just join at a bad time?

I'll say this for growing up thinking I was dumb, not dyslexic, at least no one ever offered to cure it

To all snake oil salesmen out there, you cannot cure dyslexia. I repeat, cannot cure it*. As in, it is incurable. What you can do is develop coping mechanisms that help or enable a dyslexic to interact with a non-dyslexic world.

*With the caveat that should someone come here one day offering a brain transplant, i might concede that that could cure dyslexia.

Until then, bugger off and get back to sending out the fake lottery letters. We're dyslexic, not stupid.

[BubblewrapPrincess]

We do get a fair amount of this type of thing, some worse than others.

[lomo]

BubblewrapPrincess, on 28 July 2010 - 06:31 PM, said:

We do get a fair amount of this type of thing, some worse than others.

yup usually one of the mods will clear out the rubbish but i like to mock the posters in the mean time and warn those who might come here in a state of distress. and branson don't worry things will get better.

lomo

[Rod Duncan]

We get a range of people posting.

Some are pure spam. No relation to dyslexia. No attempt to even pretend.

Some are quacks on the make - offering to help dyslexics in some magic bullet type of way. For a fee.

Some are people who have a genuine interest in helpi ng children to learn to read and write and have come across something that helps some children and believe they have stumbled on a 'cure' and wish to tell the world about it as quickly as can be.

Some are genuine, concerned individuals who have a good understanding of dyslexia and have developed some unconventional ideas which they wish to share.

Spammers and quacks need to be exposed. And they will be here, I believe. But others who genuinely want to help and believe they have discovered something - I really want to hear what they have to say. Even if it later turns out they are wrong.

[CatChester]

Rod Duncan, on 28 July 2010 - 11:50 PM, said:

Some are genuine, concerned individuals who have a good understanding of dyslexia and have developed some unconventional ideas which they wish to share.

Spammers and quacks need to be exposed. And they will be here, I believe. But others who genuinely want to help and believe they have discovered something - I really want to hear what they have to say. Even if it later turns out they are wrong.

I agree, I don't want people to stop posting thoughts and ideas, just to stop selling me their thoughts and ideas. If i decide I do want to buy their service I am quite capable of clicking a link in their signature.

[DyslexicBrian.com]

CatChester, on 28 July 2010 - 04:35 PM, said:

My word, I've been here under a week but this board just seems to be bombarded by creeps with cures! Is it really that common or did I just join at a bad time?

I'll say this for growing up thinking I was dumb, not dyslexic, at least no one ever offered to cure it

To all snake oil salesmen out there, you cannot cure dyslexia. I repeat, cannot cure it*. As in, it is incurable. What you can do is develop coping mechanisms that help or enable a dyslexic to interact with a non-dyslexic world.

*With the caveat that should someone come here one day offering a brain transplant, i might concede that that could cure dyslexia.

Until then, bugger off and get back to sending out the fake lottery letters. We're dyslexic, not stupid.

Hi CatChester,

This is very interesting... why do you feel so strongly that dyslexia can not be cured?

All the best,

[DyslexicBrian.com]

CatChester, on 30 July 2010 - 12:34 AM, said:

I agree, I don't want people to stop posting thoughts and ideas, just to stop selling me their thoughts and ideas. If i decide I do want to buy their service I am quite capable of clicking a link in their signature.

Hi CatChester,

I think you have real touched on somethng here... it's stimulated my thinking...

Are we all not 'selling' our thoughts and ideas on here?

To some greater or lesser extent don't we all try to 'sell' what we believe to other people?

For example, you seem to have very strong thoughts and ideas about there being 'no cure' for dyselxia and on this forum you have made that very clear (which is great as its how you feel)... however, I would argue that you are 'selling' the thoughts and ideas that you have about dyslexia being incurable to the people who read your posts - admitidly you are not 'selling' for monitary rewards...

Nevertheless you are trying to get them to 'buy' into your thoughts and ideas... yet, by what you have written here you say you are against people selling you their ideas and thoughts -I'm puzzled...

It is my opinion (and I'm very often 'wrong') that we are all sales people in some sense... we 'sell' the 'products' of our thinking, i.e. thoughts and ideas to others and we recieve payment for doing this... (could be money, satisfaction, aligning our thinking with how we percive other think so that we gain acceptance... etc

In my case I sell some of my thoughts and ideas and am rewarded with monatery payments... on other ocasions I sell them for free (if someone hasn't got money to pay me but really wants to be coached then I work for free - my payment on these occasions is the rewared of satisfaction that I get to be part of someones growth and development).

I'm just wondering...

Are you just against people who are trying to sell you thier thoughts and ideas about dysleixa for money?

or,

Are you against people who are trying to sell thier ideas about dyslexia because you feel these peopel might be selling things that might not be 'proven' about dyslexia and may misslead people?

All the best,

[Rod Duncan]

DyslexicBrian.com, on 30 July 2010 - 05:30 AM, said:

This is very interesting... why do you feel so strongly that dyslexia can not be cured?

My answer to this:

Dyslexia is not a disease. Thus talk of a 'cure' seems inapropriate.

Dyslexia is a difference in the functioning of the brain. In some situations it manifests as disability - most famously in a school setting. But in other situations it manifests as prodigeous ability. In those situations it is the non-dyslexics who manifest as disabled.

I have developed coping stratagies for many of the weaknesses and am working on developing coping stratagies for the ones I still have trouble with. And I am learning to maximise the strengths. But I am still just as dyslexic as I ever was.

Cure? From what?

But you may be defining dyslexia differently from me. Perhaps that is the origin of the confusion.

[CatChester]

DyslexicBrian.com, on 30 July 2010 - 06:30 AM, said:

Hi CatChester,

This is very interesting... why do you feel so strongly that dyslexia can not be cured?

Because there is nothing wrong with us to cure. We are not ill or diseased or mentally impaired. Out brains simply work differently to "normal" brains and since society is made up of mostly normals, the world is built to accommodate them rather than us. It's a bit like being left handed when most equipment out there (scissors, can openers, sewing machines etc) are made for right handed people. Can you cure them of their left-handidness also? No. You can make a child write with it's right hand, but you cant make them right handed.

Dyslexics simply need the right tools and skills to be able to process the world around them correctly.

Quote

To some greater or lesser extent don't we all try to 'sell' what we believe to other people?

With all due respect, you are grasping at straws. Positing ideas is not the same as selling them. To sell something we expect a financial return and are trying to convince people to part with their cash, whether successful or not.

I came on here and told people about my book. I did so because it is something that is important to me and dyslexia is a big part of the reason I feel like a fake.

I did not come on here, start posting about it in every thread and offering people the first three chapters for free.

Do you see the difference?

Quote

Are you just against people who are trying to sell you thier thoughts and ideas about dysleixa for money?

or,

Are you against people who are trying to sell thier ideas about dyslexia because you feel these peopel might be selling things that might not be 'proven' about dyslexia and may misslead people?

Neither per se.

What i am against is coming into a thread and being advertised to. I did not log onto google and search for "dyslexia treatments", I logged onto a dyslexia message board to discuss aspects of dyslexia with people.

Plus, I would never purchase a service without researching it anymore than I would purchase a laptop without comparing specs and prices. You have offered no proof, no studies, no evidence and you make outrageous claims of being able to cure people of something that isn't curable (short of a brain transplant).

Perhaps there is something to your service but whether there is or not, your false advertising has turned me right off even looking at your site. You claim to be cured, yet my spell-checker is going crazy with red lines under your quotes. You claim to be able to read a book (I assume you mean a novel and not a pamphlet) in an hour when that's something that's very rare indeed. So how many words can you read in a minute? Are you willing to be tested on that claim?

Stop with the talk and start with the evidence.

[Rod Duncan]

I have known people who clearly have most of the cluster of dyslexic attributes who could also speed-read.

[DyslexicBrian.com]

Hi CatChester,

Thanks for sharing your thoughts with me re selling... its very revealing

I noticed you haven't answered the following post... sorry to post it again here but I'm just very curious about how you are seeing things and learning a lot from you

Here it is again:

DyslexicBrian.com, on 30 July 2010 - 07:09 AM, said:

Hi CatChester,

I have just finished reading the 'topic' section on your profile and found it to be really interesting, moving and very insperationonal in places...

From what I have read you have so much to offer this world especially other dyslexic people as your life story, i.e. what you have had to overcome as well as what you have achieved by self publishing your first book... may be very inspiratonal to many dysleixc people.

What really stimulated me is how you close what you have written by giving one of the reasons why you joined this forum... you say:

'What finally convinced me to join was seeing a quote on the Dyslexia Scotland site, something like "for the first time ever i was with people who understood". I'd really like to be understood.'

I'm just wondering when you say that you'd really like to be understood what do you actually mean by this...

Do you mean you are looking to be understood by other people?

or,

Do you mean you are looking to be understood by yourself?

If it is the first of these two and you are looking to be understood by others then this makes me feel a bit puzzled as there seems to be a lack of congruency in what you are after for yourself and what you are prepared to give other... in other words, you want to be undersood yet you take no real time to understand me on anything more than on the surface level... you have demonstrated this by mocking what I said about being able to read a book in one hour... instead of trying to really understand me and where I might be coming from you have just dismised what I said and turned it into something to laugh about...

I'm not in anyway hurt, upset, or passiveley agressivea (a term you have used) but I am a bit puzzled as I have said... if you are looking to be really understood by other then I'm confused why you do not place much value on this when it comes to you trying to understand me...

If it is the sencond of the two questons that I asked above and you joined this forum to try to really understand yourself (which is great and another very valide reason) then I'm not puzzled by your behaviour at all (i.e. mocking what I said about being able to read a book in one hour)... as people who are trying to really undrstand themselves at a deeper level some times do things, or say things, that may appear on the surface to be shallow but in actual fact have a deeper meaning to them - which that person can then go onto explore if they choose to...

Sorry to ask you to answer these question form me but it would help me in my attempt at trying to undrstand you - and if I am to be totally truthful - to undrstand myself a bit better too

All the best,

[CatChester]

DyslexicBrian.com, on 30 July 2010 - 07:12 PM, said:

Hi CatChester,

Thanks for sharing your thoughts with me re selling... its very revealing

I noticed you haven't answered the following post... sorry to post it again here but I'm just very curious about how you are seeing things and learning a lot from you

Here it is again:

Yes I have. Go look.

And are you willing to be tested on your book in an hour claim?

Rod, i know some people can do it but it is rare (though perhaps not so rare among academic circles).

[DyslexicBrian.com]

Rod Duncan, on 30 July 2010 - 09:09 AM, said:

My answer to this:

Dyslexia is not a disease. Thus talk of a 'cure' seems inapropriate.

Dyslexia is a difference in the functioning of the brain. In some situations it manifests as disability - most famously in a school setting. But in other situations it manifests as prodigeous ability. In those situations it is the non-dyslexics who manifest as disabled.

I have developed coping stratagies for many of the weaknesses and am working on developing coping stratagies for the ones I still have trouble with. And I am learning to maximise the strengths. But I am still just as dyslexic as I ever was.

Cure? From what?

But you may be defining dyslexia differently from me. Perhaps that is the origin of the confusion.

Hi Rod,

I agree with you and thats why I use the word 'overcome' as it doesn't imply a medical viewpoint of dyslexia - in my mind anyway... it's funny how I am pretty sure that I have never used the term 'cure' within any posts other than to disscus it...

I agree with your views... mine are very similar

The only differnce perhaps is that I don't locate the cause of any of the dyslexia realted issues that I experince to exist within me what so ever... writen words are an invention that exist externally to me and like most inventions they have thier 'faults'... I attribute the difficlulties that I experince with writen language to the faults that exist within it... this view is aserted by Spencer... and McGuiness and McGuiness (I can reference them accuratly if anyone wants me to - I'm just being a bit lazy, sorry)...

So, when for example, I write as I am at the moment and I spell a word unconventionally I don't locate the cause of this to exist within me I locate it to the invention of writen language... thats one of the reaons why I am so comfortable writing without using a spell checker...

I write so much each day that if everytime I wrote a word unconventually I located the cause within me then by the end of the day I would be so depressed and would not doubt have very low self-esteem within no time at all (I used to have very low self-esteem re my writing ability)...

I also use the invention of touch typing which means I often spell words in a bit more of an unconventually way, especially when I'm flying as I press the wrong key by mistake sometimes so I locate part of cause to this as well as writen language...

I have taught myself how to edit my work to a good enougth standard - I'll often re draft up to 30 times to get it the way I want... I'm a bit of a pefectionist for some things... it took me 3 years to write one of the chapter for my thesis... it was a bit of a boring wone admitedly

I'm careful to not to let terminology into my thinking ether that may have a negative affect on my very strong dyslexia mindset and identity... for example, I stoped using the words 'coping stratgegies' because it implies that I can only cope at best and not master fully... I have masterd writing and spelling to what I consdier to be a good enough standard - my writing is of doctoral thesis standard (if there is such a thing)... I mentally reframed my old 'coping strategies' and now see them as nothing more than 'skills' that I had to learn to master the invention of written language...

I also don't let term like 'weaknesses' come into my mind or vocabulary either... as it implies that there is a strenght that is perhaps innate within the individual when it come to literacy which is strange as it is not possible according to some academics such as Frith (1999) and Kerr (2010) for dyslexia to exist on a gene level... (Frith argues that we are not predisposed to acquire literacy... Kerr argues that humans need to be using something for around 100,000 years for it to be encoded at a gene level - we have only been using written language for around 6,000 years or so)

So rather than weaknesses I just see the certain aresa of my dyselxia, i.e. the things that I may experince difficulty with, as areas that I simply need to develop some new skills in order to be able to master them as good as or even better than 'non-dyslexics'...

I'm still as dyslexic as ever I just don't see dysleixa in the same way as I once did - it just doesn't live within me in any way shape or form it exists externally to me

All the best and thanks so much Rod your post really stimulated me and I have really enjoyed writing this...

[BubblewrapPrincess]

I will repeat what I have posted else where...there is an issue with the language being used.

What Dyslexic Brian means by cure does not seem to be the same as what WE are thinking of. eg, a state where you have mostly over come your dyslexic difficulties, and have done so in part by not thinking of yourself as dyslexic, as to some this means you have a condition you cannot change, you will never read quickly or being able to ever do certain things. So you don't try to do things, and sabatage yourself. You see yourself as intrinsically disabled, but to be "cured" you need to see yourself as an individual with strenghts and weaknesses which can change over time. Once you have acepted that then you might actually try and find ways around your problems, and so improve.

Issue is...most of us regulars are pretty possitive about our dyslexia, and don't let it stop us trying to do too many things, and yes, activly work around our problems. Yet we still don't see ourselves as cured, and don't want to be, as we LIKE being dyslexic, as to us it is MORE than a disability. We already have the outlook you promote, with the slight alteration that we don't see it as cureing us, just aleviating the symptoms of some of the less desirable aspects of dyslexia.

Cure to us means a more medicalised solution, and is a term used by dodgy folk who are trying to con desperate people. So it's not the best term to use here to aide mutual understanding. I think like with your piont about selling ideas, you are maybe trying to be a bit too abstract. I am worried using the term cure would confuse new folk, as it's certainly confusing us regulars. Maybe you could simply word things a bit differently for us?

Hopfully this will help us comunicate a touch better!

[Cariad]

Nicely said Bubblewrap.

[DyslexicBrian.com]

BubblewrapPrincess, on 30 July 2010 - 06:57 PM, said:

I will repeat what I have posted else where...there is an issue with the language being used.

What Dyslexic Brian means by cure does not seem to be the same as what WE are thinking of. eg, a state where you have mostly over come your dyslexic difficulties, and have done so in part by not thinking of yourself as dyslexic, as to some this means you have a condition you cannot change, you will never read quickly or being able to ever do certain things. So you don't try to do things, and sabatage yourself. You see yourself as intrinsically disabled, but to be "cured" you need to see yourself as an individual with strenghts and weaknesses which can change over time. Once you have acepted that then you might actually try and find ways around your problems, and so improve.

Issue is...most of us regulars are pretty possitive about our dyslexia, and don't let it stop us trying to do too many things, and yes, activly work around our problems. Yet we still don't see ourselves as cured, and don't want to be, as we LIKE being dyslexic, as to us it is MORE than a disability. We already have the outlook you promote, with the slight alteration that we don't see it as cureing us, just aleviating the symptoms of some of the less desirale aspects of dyslexia.

Cure to us means a more medicalised solution, and is a term used by dodgy folk who are trying to con desperate people. So it's not the best term to use here to aide mutual understanding. I think like with your piont about selling ideas, you are maybe trying to be a bit too abstract. I am worried using the term cure would confusing new folk, as it's certainly confusing us regulars. Maybe you could simply word things a bit differently for us?

Hopfully this will help us comunicate a touch better!

Hi Bubblewrapprincess,

I love how you sum things up

I'm a bit confused why some people think that I use the word 'cure'... I'm pretty sure have been consistent in using the word 'overcome' which I think people have understood to be that same as 'cure' and so think that I use this terminology... I just posted a bit about this in the post I jsut left for Rod befor seeing this one...

You are so right about my use of terms though - I am the frist to admit that the tags that we call words that represent my thougths and concepts very often cunjur up very differen constructs in other peoples minds... so argumetns erupt... then when the forgiveing peopel like yourself and many more on this foru see through this we realise that perhps we have been in agreement all along - if not entirly but for most of what we have been discusing...

I'm the first to admit that I have a strange way of saying things (I am avery very abstract thinker) to and when I attemp to experss and idea or concept it is often quite hard work for peopel to follow what I am tryign to get out... this is down to the way I express myself not a 'fault' within the persons ability to understand me

I pay the price for this... I feel one thing in my mind that is beautiful and peace full and calm and yet when I express it some people see it as the opposit and start atacking me - my to my supprise - but then this is perhaps part of my 'dysleixa' which you think would be understood by other fellow 'dyslexic' yet as I have learn since coming back on this forum to represent Dyslexic Brian (my other id on here is uglybaruja) this is not the case with all dyslexics on this forum... I can live with this as it is the nature of the 'beast' (no doubt this word will implies something to argue about in someones mind)

Any way Bubblewrapprincess you have taught me a few things from your posts and assisted me to explore my thinking on an even deepper level...


All the best and thank you

[BubblewrapPrincess]

DyslexicBrian.com, on 30 July 2010 - 07:52 PM, said:

I also don't let term like 'weaknesses' come into my mind or vocabulary either... as it implies that there is a strenght that is perhaps innate within the individual when it come to literacy which is strange as it is not possible according to some academics such as Frith (1999) and Kerr (2010) for dyslexia to exist on a gene level... (Frith argues that we are not predisposed to acquire literacy... Kerr argues that humans need to be using something for around 100,000 years for it to be encoded at a gene level - we have only been using written language for around 6,000 years or so)

Big issue here, I take it you are asuming dyslexia is confined only to reading and writing tasks?

I veiw it as a disability/diference which manifests the most in literacy tasks, and that until 6,000 years ago this wasn't really a major problem for most people. Hence dyslexia was only discovered in the Victorian era, once reading and writing was something most people were expected to be able to do. A lot of us view ourselves as different to other people, and that this leads to a disability in a social, rather than genetic sense. (I think I am actually disabled beyond that, but I'm the minority) This is as society relies so much on writing based tasks.

Surely that makes more sense than a disability with writing developing out of the blue? Also, as to genetics, dyslexia runs in my family (roughly 1 in 2 of us are dyslexic) and actual genes have been identified which increase the chances of having dyslexia. How is this to be acounted for?

As to their being A skill that is intrinsic to literacy, we know there are several that are vital to learning to read, sight and hearing for example, and to a degree sense of touch. But you needn't be blind to have problems, what if you only had a minor difference in how you see the world? Why it might only come up on tasks like reading, it might be an issue in other areas too, but reading is the most importaint perhaps? However the actual visual problem is a real problem/disability.

What do you think of the idea of processing disabilitys, such as APD or VPD? (APD is now an acepted medical condition, and some belive it can cause dyslexia)

To me, the view of dyslexia, as more of a state of mind with out an intrisic core, is in danger of aprouching the old: "we should not lable childeren, knowing what is wrong is damaging" and "you must simply try harder/you are lazy, ect." I also worry it is behind other resurch and advancements being made in understanding dyslexia.

I have more objections, but I will finish here for now to give you a chance to respond.

This is all in the sprit of debate and exchaning ideas of course.

I agree, language problems are bound to spring up between us all. I often worry I don't get my ideas across too clearly!

All the Best,

Bubblewrap